• hector@lemmy.today
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      23 hours ago

      We have a tradition of representative government and more honest leadership. Trying to get offended on behalf of people that live under despotic governments elsewhere is the reason why everybody hates the politically correct.

      • -6-6-6-@lemmygrad.ml
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        17 hours ago

        representative governance is when you rig electoral district maps to avoid populations of people with a certain race and honest leadership is when you have a a pedophiles on both sides of the political aisle.

      • Cowbee [he/him, they/them]@hexbear.net
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        20 hours ago

        No, the west does not have any such tradition. Further, I think you’re a bit confused if you think a bunch of commies are considered “politically correct,” unless you just mean that we aren’t racist.

      • ShimmeringKoi [comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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        21 hours ago

        This is a bunch of kindergarten- level mythology about the shining city on a hill that is equal parts laughable and disgusting to anyone who has been paying attention for any length of time.

      • Rom [he/him]@hexbear.net
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        22 hours ago

        We have a tradition of representative government and more honest leadership

        no the fuck we don’t lmao

      • MiraculousMM [he/him, undecided]@hexbear.netM
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        22 hours ago

        a tradition of representative government and more honest leadership.

        Saying this right after ranting about the “weakness of our political leaders” is incredible lol

        • hector@lemmy.today
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          22 hours ago

          You guys got really upset about saying our western style governments are being turned into Eastern Style governments. I guess you are all pretty emotional aren’t you?

          It is truly an ignorant argument you are making here though, do not let however many half wits voting with your Half Baked assumption here convince you otherwise.

          • -6-6-6-@lemmygrad.ml
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            17 hours ago

            Dang that Eastern government of China for having a higher home ownership rate, higher protein intake and lower homeless rate! We’re totally turning into one of those guys!!!

            What a fucking buffoon. “emotionally” we are laughing at you.

            • hector@lemmy.today
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              9 hours ago

              Well that’s good for you, you will enjoy our new system then! Just watch your social score! The term eastern and western governments is more traditionally used in regards to the liberal democracies of the west, from the Greeks and Romans to the enlightenment era representative governments, as opposed to the all powerful rulers of egypt, the persians, the Ottoman empire, and russia. But don’t let me teach you anything.

              • T34_69 [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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                2 hours ago

                Greeks and Romans to the enlightenment era representative governments

                Slave society, slave society, slave society, and the Eastern/Western dichotomy laid out in the centuries-old political literature that you uphold in such high esteem was established by race science-touting imperialists and other chauvinists

                • hector@lemmy.today
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                  1 hour ago

                  You’re not talking about what esteem we hold the government’s in, or they’re assorted ills. We are talking about the structure of government, being representative, or being autocratic. You can say but those representative governments were mean! No shit? That is not what is an issue here. You could discount any event from history with the logic you are trying to use here.

              • -6-6-6-@lemmygrad.ml
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                5 hours ago

                Just watch your social score!

                I have to watch my credit score to own a house, have an apartment, get a decent rate on car insurance and live a normal life. Already have to do that, chucklefuck.

                “from the Greeks and Romans to the enlightenment era representative governments”

                Whom were savages and equally capable of violence on those deemed “barbarians” or lesser. The Romans and Greeks taught up some important things; but they show us nothing to take from example in a socialist governance. Drop the “TRVTH WEST” bullshit because most of here want to see the West completely destroyed!

                At least the Ottoman and Persian shahdoms during the 800s-1400s provided us the Golden Age of Islam which propelled and powered the renaissance. Oh, and most of the European renaissance came from Byzantine scholars whom had preserved and kept the classics of the Greeks fleeing the fall of Constantinople towards Italy. Can you guess what these glorious, enlightened and catholic nations did to the Byzantines during the siege?

                You do know history, you say. Why is that history paints such a dark, grim picture of Europe?

                • hector@lemmy.today
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                  8 hours ago

                  You do not realize.or care they are doing the same with palantir now, to be used in secret in biz and gov against us.

                  Since you already accept democracy such as it is still, being replaced with an eastern style autocracy ala russia it should be an easy transition for you, until you cannot pay your bills at least, after they take breakfast and dinner from you and not just lunch.

                  It will give you something to think about during your 6-12 work week, 6 days a week 12 hours a day for starvation wages.

                  • -6-6-6-@lemmygrad.ml
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                    5 hours ago

                    It will give you something to think about during your 6-12 work week, 6 days a week 12 hours a day for starvation wages.

                    Migrants think about providing a better life like this for their family as the U.S intervenes, destroys and annihilates any nascent leftist movement or anti-imperialist movement in Latin America. With over 100 interventions to boot, there’s plenty of migrants to fulfill that role in the governance of the west while a comfortable, captured proletariat and their ruling class suck up the wages and resources from the global south.

                    until you cannot pay your bills at least, after they take breakfast and dinner from you and not just lunch.

                    Well, funny enough, I had that in glorious America. I didn’t have a washing machine, hot water, a microwave or oven, proper housing and grew up inside of a demunincipalized slum. You think I got regular breakfast and dinner? Haha. Sorta, until they cut food stamps and social services further and my family didn’t apply anymore.

                    People in “horrible eastern-style autocracies” had more than me and hundreds of other people in the neighborhood I grew up in. Weird how that works, huh?

                  • Rom [he/him]@hexbear.net
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                    6 hours ago

                    It will give you something to think about during your 6-12 work week, 6 days a week 12 hours a day for starvation wages.

                    Dawg we literally have that in the US.

          • CutieBootieTootie [she/her]@hexbear.net
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            19 hours ago

            Eastern Style governments

            I can’t tell you enough how much saying this phrase is like extreme repellent to any woman who isn’t white. Like this is cartoonishly racist and nasty.

            • hector@lemmy.today
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              9 hours ago

              You do realize this is terminology used in books for hundreds of years including our modern era, terminology nobody has taken issue with until you guys here right now. The auxiliary PC Brigade. You guys are the reason the right calls everybody woke and people support their bullshit.

              It would be governmentist, bigoted against eastern style autocracies in favor of representative government, which as your group does not know what that means, it means electing leaders, having a free press, and being able to criticize people like your leaders and so forth. Eastern Style governments for thousands of years have referred to everything from Egypt to the Ottoman Empire to the Persians, a single all-powerful ruler.

              But it is good for your own mental health that you do not support representative government because it is now being taken away from you, and you are going to criticize anybody that mentions it apparently. Nice contribution.

                • hector@lemmy.today
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                  8 hours ago

                  Says the person with your username. Ha ha ha. Ok pal. Such a brave PC Warrior, how dare somebody reference the difference between Western representative governments and Eastern autocracies! It can’t be allowed. Luckily they are turning us into an Eastern style autocracy so enjoy! No don’t bother trying to help stop it, take any excuse you can to try to get the offended on behalf of other people to get your outrage boner off. Like I said, everybody hates the overly PC. Everybody.

          • MiraculousMM [he/him, undecided]@hexbear.netM
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            22 hours ago

            Eastern Style government

            Why are they called “western” and “eastern” style, what immutable characteristic are you assigning to these two groups? Answer without any redditisms for bonus points

            • hector@lemmy.today
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              21 hours ago

              Western style governments elect their leaders, they have the Free Press, and they are allowed to criticize their leaders and companies. Something that does not and has not ever existed in the East to any large degree.

              They are taking that away from us right now and you are spending your energy attacking me because it’s popular for you. Might be why we are losing. We being those that do not want to live under a supreme leader.

        • hector@lemmy.today
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          23 hours ago

          No, because I did not see anything wrong and I welcome the app probation of those seeking to get offended on behalf of other people without good cause. Nobody likes those people. The Republicans make a lot of hay out of you people by the way.

          Maybe if you read more history you would realize what I was actually saying.

          • dumpster_dove [he/him]@hexbear.net
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            13 hours ago

            read history

            Remember back in the 1950s when Iran tried to do cultural appropriation of the West by electing a prime minister? Obviously the US had to overthrow them and set up the Shah as a puppet, returning the country to its rightful place as an “Eastern government”.

            • hector@lemmy.today
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              6 hours ago

              You are talking about the actions of governments, I’m talking about the style of governments. All governments do shitty things not the least the Western Colonial powers that tried to subjugate the entire world.

              What is an issue here is having honest elections and being allowed to speak our minds and protest and such.

              Have fun in your Eastern style government in the US here pal. They love the woke pc brigades. But you will be working 6 days a week 12 hours a day until you are replaced by machines and eliminated so you know.

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                6 hours ago

                I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make here. That I wouldn’t like living under a certain type of government that you made up?

          • -6-6-6-@lemmygrad.ml
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            17 hours ago

            You can barely spell, yet you’re talking to us about history. If you knew anything about “eastern vs western” governance you’d realize that lumping the middle-east with Asia completely ignores the history of exchange and development they have shared with each other as well as the majority of nations in one sphere being subjugated by Western exploitation and capital while the other maintains it’s sovereignty through economic domination of the West with equal levels of military detterence.

            The only thing you’ve learned from history is pathetic chauvinism and a sense of patriotism for a government of pedophiles.

          • Gucci_Minh [he/him]@hexbear.net
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            22 hours ago

            Amerikkkans are so brainwashed they don’t even recognize how brainwashed they are.

            It’s precisely because you read only state department approved history that you think this way. Do you think Saddam was killing Kuwaiti babies in incubators? Do you believe Assad was using chemical weapons? What about Libya, did Gaddafi have WMDs too?

            • hector@lemmy.today
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              22 hours ago

              That is quite a jump from describing a Western Government turning into an Eastern Style government.

              You do realize those trying to turn our representative governments into an.Eastern Style autocracy are the same ones that told us all of those things you just mentioned?

              In case you didn’t notice our leaders project. Criticizing China for their iliberality as they try to do the same here.

              • Gucci_Minh [he/him]@hexbear.net
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                22 hours ago

                You are extremely incoherent and have no actual ideology except west good east bad. Not even sure what to say to this belief system where your Western governments are simultaneously trying to turn into autocracy yet ontologically good because they’re the not the east? What the fuck.

                Wait is this some arch liberal thinking where if the Democrats do imperialism and genocide it’s bringing the light of civilization to the world but if the Republicans are doing it then it becomes autocratic despotism? It would make a lot more sense if you were blue Maga tbh.

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            22 hours ago

            I do realize what you are actually saying and the fact you can’t fathom you are being racist as shit is why we hate fucking liberals.

            • hector@lemmy.today
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              22 hours ago

              Well it would be governmentist not racist.

              And it is true that I am biased against autocratic governments ruled by despots.

              But do not let me keep you here, don’t you have somebody to accuse of cultural appropriation?

              • purpleworm [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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                13 hours ago

                “When I said hip-hop is worse for the black community than the Klan, that wasn’t racist, because I was talking about a music genre. It’s genre-ist.”

                • RedWizard [he/him, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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                  8 hours ago

                  This is “I hate the government, not the people” in a new dress. Homie was probably sharing Wuhan Flu memes back in 2020 while saying, “That’s just where it’s from, I’m not being racist!”

              • Mindfury [he/him]@hexbear.net
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                20 hours ago

                But do not let me keep you here, don’t you have somebody to accuse of cultural appropriation?

                no, we’re more than happy to spend our time on continuing to correctly identify you as an uneducated and deeply unserious dipshit

                • hector@lemmy.today
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                  9 hours ago

                  I bet you do have nothing better to do.

                  Our republic is being replaced with an eastern style autocracy and you are viciously attacking someone for making that distinction that has been used for centuries.

                  To call it ignorant misses the counter productive nature of it. No one like people stretching any words to impute bigotry, not the least when your great minds find fault with existing language in writings long used without controversy.

                  You are why the right gets play calling things woke. Fox news loves you guys. Do better.

                  • RedWizard [he/him, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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                    8 hours ago

                    I bet you do have nothing better to do.

                    Are you doing that reddit brained dipshit thing where you think that every person replying to you is the same person? The only one with a lot of time on their hands here is you because you are the one continuing the conversation. That reply was from 12 hours ago, and 10 hours later you came back for more!

              • LeeeroooyJeeenkiiins [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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                22 hours ago

                describing shit like “an eastern style government” is what outs you as being profoundly 1) ignorant and 2) racist

                like, when the U.S. supported a police dictatorship in South Korea that did literally every awful thing North Korea has been accused of, including but not limited to “killing people for having the wrong haircut” (the anti- queue shit), is that a EASTERN STYLE government, because it’s a dictatorship led by perfidious asiatics? Or is it a WESTERN STYLE government, since it’s literally a puppet of a western government? (hint, it’s the second one nerd)

                like do you even have enough braincells to comprehend what’s fucked up about the fucked up shit you say

        • hector@lemmy.today
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          22 hours ago

          We are talking about the structure of government not the sum of the sins of the countries.

            • hector@lemmy.today
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              21 hours ago

              Western style governments refer to having elections, a free press, being allowed to criticize the powerful. That is not my terminology by the way, that is hundreds of years of terminology.

              • purpleworm [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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                13 hours ago

                That is not my terminology by the way, that is hundreds of years of terminology.

                The minimum number of years this could be is 200. At that time, 1825, most of Europe was run by monarchies still, with just a couple of hemi-demi-semi-democratic republics and hybrid governments (like England, excluding its colonies, which it ruled over despotically). +1 more for America as another fractionally democratic state. idk, I think if you’re calling those governments totally superior to “Eastern Governments,” you might just be, uh, uncritically parroting racists.

              • spacecadet [he/him]@hexbear.net
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                21 hours ago

                This is again similar to what the system claims vs. what the system produces/actually functions. We do have elections, but we also have like 66% voter turnout and we also have studies indicating massively popular policies never get passed (e.g. universal healthcare, tax billionaires, etc). Free press is debatable. All US mainstream news outlets are owned by the billionaire class, hardly any of them speak pro Palestine positions. Manufacturing Consent does a good job explaining how the US supposedly free press functions to ultimately peddle state department talking points and status quoisms.

                • hector@lemmy.today
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                  21 hours ago

                  Obviously the system has never been perfect and further corrupted from me Glory Days of the post war era however lacking they were,

                  But we kept elections and freedom of expressio, something eastern governments rarely had going back 2500 years.

                  And what you say is my fucking point to begin with. They are taking away our governmental structure, and replacing it with an Eastern style one, which is to say an autocracy with no freedom of expression, no freedom of the press, and us at the complete mercy of the Criminal Justice System.

                  However bad it is now, you better believe it’s going to get a whole lot worse. Unless you guys get your head out of the establishment Democrats’ ass and help get some electable, populist, and aggressive candidates that know how to build and run a political machine.

                  • -6-6-6-@lemmygrad.ml
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                    17 hours ago

                    “But we kept elections and freedom of expression, something eastern governments rarely had going back 2500 years.”*

                    The “west” has a history of colonialism and vast destruction of the global south through conquest and death that continues in the spirit of economic domination of third world nations via resource extraction and debt-traps through the IMF. At no point does our “Rich History” matters when all we’ve used it for is to oppress entire nations, classes of people and races of people.

                    “which is to say an autocracy with no freedom of expression, no freedom of the press, and us at the complete mercy of the Criminal Justice System.”

                    wowza almost like suspected anarchists and communists in the 1920s-1980s under the U.S government!

                  • Nakoichi [they/them]@hexbear.net
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                    17 hours ago

                    In case you don’t know all the people accusing you of Nazi level racism and insinuating you should be executed for the levels of Nazi racism you are experiencing here should at least give you pause and make you reflect on your racist remarks.

                    Otherwise I would not really give two shits if someone splattered your brains over a brick wall.

                  • CutieBootieTootie [she/her]@hexbear.net
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                    19 hours ago

                    But we kept elections and freedom of expressio, something eastern governments rarely had going back 2500 years.

                    Literally talk to one person from “the east” and you’ll realize how absurdly wrong you are

                  • cricbuzz [he/him]@hexbear.net
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                    19 hours ago

                    Unless you guys get your head out of the establishment Democrats’ ass

                    holy shit dumbass, you clearly have not spent a single second on this site have you?

                    replacing it with an Eastern style one, which is to say an autocracy with no freedom of expression, no freedom of the press, and us at the complete mercy of the Criminal Justice System.

                    Famously, countries in the east have no freedom of expression and no freedom of the press, right? PLEASE understand that you have no idea what you’re talking about. You’re honestly telling me that you buy the propaganda that China, a country with 1.4 billion people, has no freedom of expression and no freedom of the press?

                    People are calling you a Western Chauvinist because you are spouting shit like this, which JUST SO HAPPENS to also align with the US State Department talking points. Hmm… So maybe you could stop posting and responding for a minute, and have the courage to listen to the comrades here that are telling you you have no clue what the fuck you’re talking about.

                  • spacecadet [he/him]@hexbear.net
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                    21 hours ago

                    I understand your point and frustration but the impasse we are at here I believe is that the avg hexbear user would claim liberal democracy will ALWAYS trend in this direction. The system is what it does. Sure, I think it’s good to elect strong socialist-adjacent progressives in your local areas to improve the life of working class people, but (someone correct me I’m mistaken) the philosophical position here is that the end result of the system is always fascism and capitalist dictatorship. It will always trend to this conclusion.

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            22 hours ago

            The purpose of a system is what it does. You can say it’s freedom and democracy all you want but all I’ve seen out of it is genocide, human trafficking, and money laundering regardless of which of your capitalist parties is in charge.

            • hector@lemmy.today
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              21 hours ago

              Not the point. Describing the system of government as being better does not endorse everything that government has done, not the least as it has become the superpower.

              Western style governments elect leaders, they have free press, they can criticize their leaders, and so forth. Eastern governments have never had that tradition. Might makes right, you criticize the leader you are in trouble, no honest media exists, and they do not elect leaders in any honest way.