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This is so exactly right
exactly this is so right
Right, exactly this is so
Is so exactely this right?
Exactly right, so this is.
So right, this is—exactly.
Note:
I’m just here to collect my downvote.
But men and woman are from earth i think
source?
men and women are both from the planet Y’slub-ilth in the gamma quadrant, however men arrived ~7 years later.
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Men and Women are different strictly because of cultural reasons. many of which that are inherited from religious beliefs and practices.
At the core there’s not that much difference except the hormonal stuff.
how do you know that it’s purely cultural? Do you have a source for this?
there’s no difference because trans women are women and trans men are men, and nonbinary people are valid.
It was already discussed earlier: men and women are distributions. Two distributions can be distinct even if there are overlaps between the distributions. For instance, men are much more likely to have beards than women are. This is a difference between men and women, and is not invalidated by the existence of women with beards.
trans women are trans women. trans men are trans men.
all people are valid. but don’t expect all people to validate you.
i really have an issue with trans people who think i must validate them in their identity or i’m a horrible peron. I dont’ expect them to validate me in mine. Just go live your life and i’ll live mine. I’m happy to acknoledge your humanity, but i don’t care about your gender identity anymore than your nationality or your taco toppings.
to me it’s equally as obnoxious when someone demands I validate their ‘heritage’ or their ‘hotness’ or ‘success’ or whatever. just leave me alone.
I thought it was men that had the y.
People think X is good and Y is bad?
people think XX and XY are good bad.
First I’m hearing of it 🤷♂️
Hey now, are we getting real, on the interwebs!? Ludicrous!
Edit: Oh and don’t forget the people that identify as other
Sorry, maybe I’m tired but I’m not getting the shadow puppet allegory. Maybe we thought the shadows were real, like you thought the differences between the sexes were real. Okay, got it. But convinced the puppets making them are real? The puppets are real, right? Unless the metaphor is that both shadows and puppets are not real people and their anthropomorphism is all in your head? So both the battle of the sexes and the woke-ism are both constructs we should recognize as such?
Ok, think I worked it out. Thanks for coming.
there is a difference between appearance, and reality.
that’s what it’s about.
and yes, battle of the sexes is very much appearance vs reality. people want to believe in the mythology they tell each other about ‘men’ and ‘women’. not the fact that we are mostly the same apart from our sex organs and some hormonal chemistry. there are differences, but they aren’t as titanic as people want to believe.
all i know is that men and women both hate it if you don’t treat them like ‘men’ and ‘women’.
people generally enjoy sexism, especially if it is beneficial to them.
I don’t believe this is true.
Must be nice for you?
All I know is that people generally hate it when you make inferences about them based on their demographic.
yeah and? generally those inferences are true. most of us are in the bell curve.
what i find that people really hate, is they make a inference about you, you tell them they are wrong, and they tell you to go fuck yourself.
I get that a lot. because i’m not a part of the bell curve and it really pisses people off that i don’t fit the stereotype they have of me.
but the vast majority of people do fall in that bell curve, based on sex, race, class, education, whatever. most of us are average. but that tends to offend people’s egos. they all want to think they are exceptional. i live in a city full of wealthy people who all want to tell you how poor and broke they are. it’s hilarious. very very few of them understand that they are wealthy, because they are so jealous of the neighbor who has a slightly better car/apartment/lifestyle.
and they do with this sex, race, and whatever else too. ‘if only i was taller’ ‘if only i was white’ ‘if only i was a man’ etc. Met so many female doctors who are RIPSHIT at the world because they think they’d be making 550K instead of 520K if they had a penis. and they are probably right. They’d also probably make 550K if they were a few inches taller. But none of them can seem to grasp the fact they 30K is not even an amount of money that would have any measurable impact on their life.
The bell-curve is extremely high dimensional. This means that most people are outside 2 stdevs on at least one axis.
So the problem with this is that it’s falsely equating chauvinism and mysoginy with woke and feminism.
Feminist theory spans many different ideas, but at its heart is about creating more equity between the sexes. The motivating force of feminism arose at a time where women couldn’t control their bodies, their families, or even their finances. Women could even get their own credit cards until 1975.
People will claim that it’s different now and that everyone is legally equal, but systemically there’s still a lot of work to do. The vast majority of the hierarchical control of this country are positions held mostly by men. From politicians, CEO, lawyers, judges, and even police officers, these are all mostly men and are increasingly becoming more conservative.
You can’t create equity by pretending were all equals, but then ignore the fact that laws are being passed to control only one of the sexes.
The point it no amount of bigotry will ever end bigotry
bigotry feels good. makes people feel powerful.
Right, but the point is you’re requesting bigotry with feminism and “woke”.
Can men experience misandry? Can white people experience racism?
Because if you are part of the radfems who think those things are impossible then we are coming from two completely different realities here.
Can men experience misandry? Can white people experience racism?
Yes, but to falsely equate misandry with misogyny or racism against white people with racism against say black people is idiotic. It requires someone to ignore hundreds of years of history and the systemic hierarchy of our current society.
While someone can be racist to a white person, white people are not being systemically disenfranchised as a minority. While someone can be mean to someone because they do not like men, men are not systemically disenfranchised by women, as women do not hold the positions of power in the hierarchy.
Because if you are part of the radfems who think those things are impossible then we are coming from two completely different realities here.
I very much doubt you have ever met anyone in real life who holds these beliefs as you claim them. More than likely you have projected that belief onto people who disagree with you, or are purposely obtuse when someone is explaining the difference between racism and systemic racism.
I very much doubt you have ever met anyone in real life
I hear these bigots every day in these communities.
I’m sorry, but the correct answer was that all bigotry is bad, and that we shouldn’t make such long excuses to treat people differently.
Amen. What I hate so much is most ‘woke’ types just want to replace existing bigotry they disagree with it with their own form of bigotry.
They also love to ramble abotu power structures and hierachy… but what do they want to do about it? put themselves on top of that hierarchy so they can dole out punishment and reward to those they regard as ‘loyal’.
They fail to realize that their fantasies of justice as just inverting the roles, not ‘fixing’ anything.
hear these bigots every day in these communities.
If you hear these bigots every day then you would easily be able to link an example for me to look at, right? Also ignoring the fact that Lemmy or really any social media platform is not an actual example of real life…
I’m sorry, but the correct answer was that all bigotry is bad,
And when did I claim anything different?
and that we shouldn’t make such long excuses to treat people differently.
And when did I excuse treating people differently? I simply rebutted your claims that conflated feminism with misandry, or your conflation of racism against white people with racism against minorities.
While we should treat people the same, the work required to do that differs between different groups of people based on our current social hierarchy.
at what point is the piper ever paid?
how can you ever make progress on these issues if there is a perpetual historical debt to be ‘paid’?
I’m not responsible for slavery. It’s totally bizarre and counterproductive to assume that I am. Anymore that is to assume I’m responsible for sexual crimes against women.
The people who did those things were responsible for them. If they are dead, well best we can do is forgive and move on and try to make things better in the future.
Also you’re insane if you don’t think women and minorities don’t hold positions ove power in the hierarchy… and actively seek to re-enforce it. Power is not exclusive to white rich guys.
I’m not responsible for slavery. It’s totally bizarre and counterproductive to assume that I am. Anymore that is to assume I’m responsible for sexual crimes against women.
Lol, when you’re done fighting the world’s largest strawman we can have an act discussion. I never accut anyone of this?
The people who did those things were responsible for them. If they are dead, well best we can do is forgive and move on and try to make things better in the future.
You are pretending as if systemic inequalities are a thing of the past and ignoring the fact that these historic inequalities have modern consequences.
you don’t think women and minorities don’t hold positions ove power in the hierarchy…
Minority does not mean non-existent… The whole point of a hierarchy is that it only matters who controls the top of the hierarchical structure.
Power is not exclusive to white rich guys.
No, it’s just almost exclusive to rich white guys… It really makes everything fine as long as there’s token representation. Got it.
I believe the poster is feminist and is saying “woke, feminist” facetiously and just pointing out a tendency of certain online spaces to subscribe to patriarchy but in the opposite direction.
believe the poster is feminist and is saying "woke, feminist
I don’t think so, it’s increasingly common to conflate all feminism as misandry or claim all gender analysis is inherently sexist because you are viewing an array of problems through the lens of gender.
certain online spaces to subscribe to patriarchy but in the opposite direction.
You can’t subscribe to the opposite of patriarchy…that would be a matriarchy, which doesn’t exist in any modern western country, or arguably anywhere in the modern world.
This is the problem with equivocating misandry with misogyny. Yes people can be sexist towards men, but that sexism isn’t the social norm, nor is it enforced through systemic or legal means.
a lot of modern feminist is a celebration of misandry and female victimhood, at least online feminism.
sexism towards men is a social norm. it’s just a social norm that feminists are totally cool with
feminists generally don’t think they should be discriminated against for their sex, but they also seem to have no issue generally discriminating against men for their sex, or feeling like patriarchal norms should only apply to men in their lives.
easy example is that women are disgusted by men watching porn, but see nothing wrong with reading erotica. it’s bad/wrong ti idealize female bodies for sex, but totally cool if you do it to male bodies, apparently.
a lot of modern feminist is a celebration of misandry and female victimhood, at least online feminism.
A lot of men’s rights advocacy is just a celebration of misogyny and male victimhood, at least online.
sexism towards men is a social norm. it’s just a social norm that feminists are totally cool with
sexism towards women is a social norm. it’s just a social norm that men who use refer to women as females are totally cool with
feminists generally don’t think they should be discriminated against for their sex, but they also seem to have no issue generally discriminating against men for their sex, or feeling like patriarchal norms should only apply to men in their lives.
I am a feminist, I am a married man. I’m not discriminating myself…
easy example is that women are disgusted by men watching porn, but see nothing wrong with reading erotica.
According to who? Most feminist believe that women should be able to make choices about their own body and sexuality, including participating in sex work. Youre just making shitty assumptions about a topic you have no education in.
politicians, CEO, lawyers, judges, and even police officers
I do rather enjoy the kind of feminism that abolishes these.
This sounds a lot like the “everything will be better if we just act colorblind” fallacy. Gender is a social construct, sure, but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t demonstrably affect how people who strongly buy into performing a given gender behave.
bold of you to say “fallacy.” This is the equity vs equality debate.
they’d be different.
better is a function of what you want the outcome to be.
Men and women are, on average, different enough that talking about those differences can be useful. However, there is no obligation to act like the average member of one’s sex.
…or to assume that you’re one of “the bad ones” when others make generalizations
When you start making people feel the need to defend themselves you’ve probably gone overboard on the generalization.
When you start making people feel the need to defend themselves you’ve probably gone overboard on the generalization.
only if that generalization isn’t against men and ‘majority’ groups. if you wanna bash white people, men, heterosexuality, etc. people pretty much give you free reign. especially in ‘left’ leaning spaces.
…or to make generalizations in the first place.
Look, if somebody says “ugh, women are so…” I’m going to assume they’re talking about me, if they don’t qualify with “some women”
Insisting that the puppets making them are real
You mean the hands?
Or shadow puppets
Was this whole post just an elaborate shot at shadow puppeteers?
Take that Hacivat!
